Introduction in Miguel’s words: I came back to Mexico filled with excitement and started to work on myself. I started my changes, I am a man. I have always been a man. I am more healthy mentally, I feel amazing and blessed. Now with a beautiful family. A gorgeous wife, Josselin and a handsome son Emir. I am Miguel.


Sergio: One of the first questions we have is why did your family migrate
to the US?


Miguel: Basically, my family was in danger due to my dad's job, so we had to
leave and move to the US.


Sergio: Your dad never talked to you about what happened?


Miguel: He did. He told me that since he was a lawyer, he had to do his job
and kick someone out of a property. When he did that, another person was
like, "Hey, I need you to kick this person out of this property." And it
was a big offer and he offered to pay in American money. He did more
research on it, even it sounds crazy to me, and he noticed that this person
worked for the mafia here in Mexico. And my dad refused and several months
he was being harassed. Even came to the point where finally he came in
danger too, even his life, our lives, was threatened. Our lives were
threatened and that's when we moved to the US.


Sergio: What does your family leave behind?


Miguel: Well mostly family here.


Sergio: Do you remember your first day in the United States?


Miguel: To be honest, no I don't [Laughs]. I was too young.


Sergio: How about your first memory?


Miguel: Was in school actually, in elementary school. I remember going there
and not knowing a lot of English at all. I remember not understanding
English, but somehow I managed and learned English fluently.


Sergio: Were there any teachers that really stuck in your mind that you
still remember that you still think about?


Miguel: Yes. Oh yes. Yes I do. I think in around 2000, I had, I think, a
teacher named Ms. Walker in Corpus Christi. She was really, really sweet. I
loved how she taught. I would learn so quickly with her. She was one of my
favorite teachers. That's one of the teachers I do remember.


Sergio: What was your overall experience in school in the US?


Miguel: I think it was a little bit normal, like you see in movies and
stuff. Of course, I wasn't you know, bullied or anything. We all have those
gossips and everything around high school. But I really liked it, going to
high school in the US. It is what I've known.


Sergio: Were you involved in any school activities?


Miguel: Yeah. I was in JROTC, which is kind of like a glimpse into the air
force or whichever military branch the school had. So it was pretty neat. I
turned out to be the physical trainer commander. I had a lot of ribbons. I
had a lot of fun. I still remember my instructors, which were Major Han and
Sergeant Hardy. It was great. We traveled, we went to Washington, D.C.,
came back. So had a lot of opportunities there.


Sergio: So, what kind of values did you get from that experience? What do
you think really stuck with you?


Miguel: Discipline. Teamwork. It brought me out of my shell. Before I was
super quiet, not talkative, it was really hard for me to talk. Going to
JROTC helped me a lot to break out of my shell and experience new things,
talk to new people, all that good stuff.


Sergio: I think earlier you mentioned that you didn't know you were
undocumented until at some point. When was that point and what was that
process?


Miguel: When I was 18.


Sergio: When you were 18? So this was after you were JROTC?


Miguel: No. Yeah, this is after all that stuff. I didn't really know. People
would say I looked too young for my age. And I started to believe it. I'm
like "Am I really this age?" And then I looked through documents and I was
like, "Hey dad, where is my birth certificate, my documents?" So he's like,
"Oh, it's right there above my desktop and everything.” I looked and I was
like, "Oh snap, I am this age then. This is interesting." And I was like,
"Oh, what is this place?" And they were like, "That's the... Where you were
born in Mexico. You were born there, you were born in Mexico in that
hometown." And it's like, "Hey." Yeah, before that I was kind of oblivious
to where I was born because it didn't really come to mind. It didn't worry
me or was not a priority in my world. My priority was friends, living a
normal life over there, looking for a job or going to school or doing all
that kind of stuff. My significant other. But that wasn't really on my
mind.


Sergio: So was it a struggle to kind of be in JROTC? It's like a very like
American thing to do.


Miguel: No, it wasn't a struggle. It came like second nature to me to be in
JROTC. It was really sweet, awesome to be there and to be a part of
something bigger than yourself.


Sergio: And when they found out did that?


Miguel: It sort of crushed me because I was like, well in my mindset I
was... It was a bittersweet thing. I was like, "Oh, okay. I'm not only
American, but I'm also now Mexican American.” So it was a little bit to
adapt to it. It explains why I speak Spanish and maybe this, and why my mom
cooked certain foods than other American friends do. So it was, I guess the
best of both worlds you can say.


Sergio: Do you ever think about joining the military?


Miguel: Here or over there?


Sergio: Over there from JROTC?


Miguel: I did think about it, but it was like, "No, I'll probably get
deployed and miss my family too much."


Sergio: So did you work in the US?


Miguel: Yes, I did.


Sergio: What was your favorite job and what was it like?


Miguel: My favorite job, well that's an easy one. Abercrombie and Fitch, I
worked there as a model impact. Basically, what you do is you wear their
clothes, you model for them, and you are in retail. So you go ahead and
sell clothes, sell the clothes, so help the customer out, customer service
as well as put up the clothes when they shipped in. When you ship them in,
you get them in boxes, open the boxes, separate the guys and the girls, so
on and so forth. Pretty easy job.


Sergio: How about the least favorite thing about the United States?


Miguel: People discriminate too much against the Mexicans and other foreign
country people. If you're from Arabia or if you from Spain or Mexico or
anything like that, they'll look down on you a little bit. But they're not
noticing that their origin is also from somewhere else. We just keep ours a
little bit more alive.


Sergio: What are some of your favorite things in the US, like your best
experiences?


Miguel: I mean they have big parties but comparing here to the US, it kind
of doesn't compare. I mean Houston's beautiful. It has its beauties, but to
be honest I felt pretty closed in, a little bit claustrophobic. I was
limited to what I can do to with myself and what I can do with my life
until I came here. Here I feel a little bit more like I can breathe. I have
more opportunities here than I did over there.


Sergio: I guess coming back to the racism that you mentioned, did you ever
have an experience that you faced that discrimination?


Miguel: Not particularly. I’ve seen other people a little bit. The only time
I've seen it for myself is when I got deported, went to court, went through
all that. I had to go ahead, and they had to believe someone else other
than myself. So kind of kept looking at me like I didn't belong there, when
I did.


Sergio: About how you returned to Mexico. Can you tell me more about what
happened and what led to the process?


Miguel: Like my journey here or like how I traveled here or how?


Sergio: What was the whole incident that led to you being arrested and then
being deported and what happened during that? What happened after that?
Kind of walk me through it.


Miguel: Basically, to summarize it a little bit, I got into the wrong crowd
when I was partying a lot—this happened after a breakup. I found someone at
a frat party, a house party with a lot of people there. You know how frat
parties are. Basically, I didn't know the girl at the time, and we became
close, but later realized she's not a very good person to be around with.
It was like, "You know what? This isn't very good. I have to stop hanging
out with you. I'm sorry, can't be friends can't hang out. I have to delete
you from my life basically." I blocked her on everything. She did not like
that. She came back to the point where basically she told people that I did
something to her that I didn't. For a year I fought the case, but they saw
me as “Well, foreign person, we'll just kick them out, whatever.” And
that's when Trump just came to power as a president. So I'm like, "Oh
great, that's not good for me."


Sergio: So, at what point in the process did Trump come to power?


Miguel: It was by the end of the year of maybe 2017, 18 , when he came to
power. I'm guessing. I don't remember.


Sergio: Where were you in the process?


Miguel: I was going to court and that's when they're like, "Oh, okay, well
things have changed a little bit. This means that you're going to have to
go to jail for this for 10 days." When I did, I fought it as best as I
could. But after the year I couldn't anymore. No one was there. My dad was
at work. My current girlfriend at that point was coming from school to
where I was. So I was just sitting there. They were like, "Okay, just sit
here." I was in the court room and they were like, "Okay, well we need your
stuff, your cell phone, everything." So I gave him my stuff. They put them
in a baggie.


Miguel: They took me in the back door. They put me in a holding cell to go
to jail. Of course, going to jail wasn't so fun. I was there for 10 days.
It was pretty difficult because I couldn't see my family, couldn't see my
significant other or anything. I would talk to them on the phone, but
surprisingly that was the hardest part. The easiest part was when I went to
the immigration.


Sergio: This was the immigration detention center?


Miguel: Yeah, the holding cell is totally different. They wake you up like
at three o'clock in the morning, I was like half asleep and then they were
like, "Okay, well sign this." They make you sign.


Miguel: What I remember was they can only hold you for 24 hours after the
time that you're supposed to leave. ICE usually has a hold on you so that
you can't get out and that time expired and they made me sign something. At
that point I was half asleep so I didn't know what was going on. So, me
signing it told them that, “Yes, it's okay to take me to the immigration
place.” So from there it was really cold. They took me, and in the holding
cell was terrible. They would treat you like you're a criminal, you didn't
belong there. They held you in this little cell, like bathrooms and
everything. It was really small. I was like, if you go to the zoo and you
see like an animal just sitting there, it's basically that size. Finally,
when I got my clothes, I changed, went to the detention center, which is a
different facility, different building.


Miguel: That's when everything started to fall in place. I felt lighter on
my feet. I still miss my family, but they're a little bit more crushed than
I was. Finally, my time there came to an end. They woke me up one morning
and I got to leave. I went ahead and left. They put me in a van. In the van
it was pretty hot. The women will be in one side and the men will be in the
back side and there'll be like a gate in the middle so we won't do anything
to each other or they won't hurt us. So they separated the men from the
women. When it was about what, five, four hours to get to [foreign
language, location].


Sergio: That's where?


Miguel: Yeah, that's when they were like, "Oh, we're here." They threw the
food at the ground and threw our stuff at the ground so we can pick it up.
And they were like, "Okay, well there's a border, walk." And we will have
to pick up our food from the ground and walk over there and they will have
their guns. So if anyone would try to turn around and go back to the border
to the US border, they will shoot you. So, I was like, "Well, I don't want
to go back over there." So, I went ahead and just took my stuff, left, and
they greeted me with like open arms to Mexico.


Sergio: So before you got to Mexico, how long was it while you were in the
detention facility?


Miguel: 10 to 12 days, I believe.


Sergio: And before that you were in the holding cell you said?


Miguel: [Affirmative noise].


Sergio: How long were you in the holding cell?


Miguel: For me, it felt for eternity, but it was like five, six, seven
hours.


Sergio: Five, six, seven hours?


Miguel: Five to seven hours, between that. You lose time because you don't
have a clock or anything in there. So you don't know.


Sergio: And the conditions where you were being held?


Miguel: So poor, it was poor. There was writings on the wall, there was
toilet paper, piss everywhere. Excrement. I mean they didn't really clean
that well in the holding cell. They cleaned more in the detention center
than the holding cell. The thing that I've noticed was actually, when they
would detain people, I would see that the guards there would be like, "Hey
look, this is nice belt. You want to keep it?" They would keep the stuff
that they would take from the immigrants. So I'll be like, "Okay, that's
kind of messed up. That's not yours, that's theirs." But I couldn't really
do anything.


Miguel: The other thing that I found out was they added actually felonies to
my thing, to have an actual reason to deport me. When I went to court, I
saw that they were like, "Oh, I see that you got deported before." I'm
like, "No, I never got deported before. That's when I was in court before I
got deported.’ And they were like, "Yeah, I see here. You were deported
before when you were four years old." And I'm like, "No, I was not. I would
have remembered that." And of course the person opposite that wanted me out
would be like, "Well yeah, maybe you were too young to remember." I was
kind of mad. So I was like, "I'm pretty sure I would remember that. It's
kind of traumatizing for a kid to get deported, even for an adult it's
traumatizing."


Miguel: The judge was like, "So, she got deported at four years old? And
crossed the border back to the US, like crossing the desert and all?"
They're like, "Yeah, you got deported." And I'm like, "No, I would have
remembered a terrible desert and being hungry and sick and maybe, you know,
I would remember that. That's traumatizing for a kid. No, I never been
deported." So, they were like, "Okay, well whatever" [Weak chuckle]. I was
like, "All right, well that makes no sense but okay." But then I got even
more angry because they were trying to get rid of me. I was like, "Okay,
well I just want my deportation order, just give me my deportation." They
were like, "Okay, we'll get you your deportation." That was it.


Sergio: So at the end of the day. Was it a voluntary departure or was it, a
deportation order?


Miguel: I think it was both in a way [Chuckle].


Sergio: A little bit of both?


Miguel: Yeah, because I didn't want to stay there any longer and I didn't
want to stay there for a year to fight the case. I'm just going to be like,
“You know what, whatever. Just deport me for 10 years. I'm not able to go
back for 10 years, well nine more years.” So, I'm like, “Okay, whatever.
I'll just live my life.”


Sergio: When you returned to Mexico, you mentioned you had a warm welcome.
What was that like when you walked in [foreign language, location]


Miguel: It was like my world just turned upside down for the better. It was
something different. It was like seeing the light at the end of the tunnel
to be honest. Seeing something... People, so warming, so welcoming, people
that will actually want... Feeling wanted in a place. It was different for
me than living in the US. I didn't feel, basically, wanted there. I would
have to look for it in people themselves. But feeling wanted in a place
that is all around you, it's something amazing.


Sergio: What made it so? What kind of things happened as soon as you walked
in?


Miguel: They gave me food. They took care of me. They had a smile on their
face. They made me feel like I was an actual person and I didn't feel that
for a while.


Sergio: You didn't feel it in the US?


Miguel: No, I felt out of place in the US. I know people are, "Oh, it's the
big dream." I'm like, "Yeah, but it's not the same as here."


Sergio: So, when you were welcomed, they gave you food, they gave you
water. What happened after that? What was the transition like?


Miguel: I called my dad, told them where I was. They gave me my papers.
Basically, they guide you through everything. So basically, they were like,
“Okay, well give me your name, give me all this, we'll put you in the
system here.” I did, I gave him my birthday, everything that they needed.
We went to a second building. That's the building where they gave me the
papers, my ID, which is a piece of paper with my name on it and information
about me and then a picture of me. And they used that to give me 10% off on
buses, traveling, airplane tickets, anything. And from there we went to a
different place—that's where you can call your family, whoever you need to
send you money. That's where you can go ahead and trade your American money
to Mexican money.


Miguel: And that's what I did. I waited there for a little bit and they were
like, "Okay." Well I bought my ticket for my bus, I went with some people.
And from there I bought my ticket and from buying my ticket I went to
Monterey. From Monterey I went to here, Mexico City. From Mexico City I
went to [foreign language, location] that I had family in. So there—


Sergio: How did you do that? How did you travel?


Miguel: How did I travel? Bus, all bus. It was long ride [Chuckle], a very
long ride, it took like 17 hours. I was like "Wow." I was super tired when
I was looking for my grandparents. I saw my grandfather and I didn't know.
I knew him, but I didn't recognize him. So, some people were helping—


Sergio: Was that the first time you net your grandfather?


Miguel: Yes, since I was four, so I don't remember him, I don't remember him
at the time.


Sergio: Had you ever seen him before, like over Skype?


Miguel: Nope, maybe over video, but people look so different from video than
from in person. So yeah, I didn't know how he looked like. So, I called my
dad and I was like, "Hey, how does your dad look like?" [Chuckle]. And he
was like, "Well he's pretty short. He looks pretty white. He has green
eyes." I'm like, "Oh, he has green eyes. I didn't know this. I was looking
for a Brown-eyed short person." And he was like, "No, he has green eyes."
I'm like, "Okay." So finally, actually, my cousin found me, and he called
me by my name. He had a deep, really deep voice—I got scared. I was like,
"Yeah, that's me." And he's like, "Okay, well come with me. Your
grandfather's over here." And I'm like, "Okay. Well, they found me"
[Chuckles].


Miguel: So, I went to their house. They were asking me a few questions—my
Spanish wasn't so well back then like it is now. And they said “Hi,” they
introduced themselves. Of course, I knew off the bat it was my dad's
family, him and his brother look so much alike. And I took a shower. It was
very different because their home is a little bit more from when my dad was
younger. They had the house since forever. They had a boiler in the back
and stuff like that. It was very different customs here than over there.
They had a washer, but it was very different. I was like a little bit in
shock still where I was. I'm like "Okay." At first they were strangers to
me, so I was like "Uh.”


Sergio: Whose house was it?


Miguel: My grandparents. Yeah.


Sergio: Was this like a completely nice place?


Miguel: Yeah. It was very homey to put it in those words. Yeah.


Sergio: Is that not something you had in the US, or?


Miguel: I did. My parents, very neat home. But again, I felt an atmosphere
in the US totally different from Mexico. It's a little bit more eye-opening
here than over there. Or I should say more alive.


Sergio: More lively?


Miguel: More lively here than over there.


Sergio: [Laughs]. Is that because you can hear the music [crosstalk
00:27:27]?


Miguel: [Laughs]. But in a good way.


Sergio: So, was that transition difficult after you kind of met with your
grandparents?


Miguel: For me, surprisingly it wasn't that difficult. Adapting to a
different environment was pretty easy for me. Since back in the US it was
pretty difficult. For here, I just saw it as a new beginning, a new way for
me to start build my life, be an adult. I'm adult, write my own story. And,
for me, that was a little bit exciting. My parents are still a little bit
sad that I'm not with them, but for me to open my wings, I see it that way.
For me to start a new life, basically. And I did.


Sergio: A little bit of an opportunity for you, you think?


Miguel: Yeah.


Sergio: Aside from learning Spanish, what other things did you have to get
used to?


Miguel: A little bit of the customs, kind of like transportation—I was used
to in-car transportation—through the Metro or Combi or microbus. So, it’s a
little bit different. It's a lot better, but I do miss driving sometimes
because I did drive a lot over there, but other times I'm just like "I
don't want to drive."


Sergio: Were you able to get a job right after?


Miguel: Yes, I was quickly to get a job.


Sergio: You said you wanted to go to school, you're still working on that.


Miguel: [Affirmative noise]. Is there any way we can wrap this up because I
have to get back to work? Sorry about that.


Sergio: I guess, two more important questions. In what ways do you think
that the US shaped who you are now?


Miguel: The US? I mean people in the US, even in my parents, I see that they
see Mexico as very dangerous, very dark place to live. So they shaped me to
believe into something that is not true. Completely not true. Actually the
opposite. Coming to Mexico made me see that it was amazing to be here. It's
actually a little bit more safer than over there. Over there, everywhere
around the world, you get jumped, whatever. But over here, I mean I have
been jumped before, but I still rather get jumped here than over there.
It's a weird thing to say, but it's true because over there they won't
think twice of killing you to say the least. I mean they bring guns to
school. They're a little bit more violent in the US than here and they
think here is violent. No, it's just we're more open showing you dead
bodies on newspapers than I've noticed in over there. Over there, they were
a little bit more like babying you and sugar coating it.


Sergio: Is there anything that the US or Mexico can do better at helping
you kind of return, reintegrate?


Miguel: To return? Well for the US they should not just put fake felonies on
you for example. Because I know they just kind of put stuff together and
they're like, "Okay, here." But they can do a little bit more research on
that and actually see what happened. If I got deported for that one reason,
they could have just done a little bit more research instead of rushing
through. That's what they can do better.


Sergio: Okay. Thank you so much for your time Miguel.